Speaker 1: 0:00

He had a 185. He decided to put skis on the aircraft landing on skis and one of the ski gear breaks on landing Prop strike aircraft tumbles. Complete aircraft destroyed 275,000. We turned the claim into the insurance company and this is where the insurance company matters and your relationship, your long-term relationship, with that company matters. That's the difference between zero coverage and $275,000 in aircraft coverage.

Speaker 2: 0:32

Hello, hello and welcome everybody to the Jet Life Podcast. My name's Tom Lelio, I'm your ultimate jet guide and today we're pulling back the curtain on private aviation insurance. Whether you're a buyer or a broker, we're going to the curtain on private aviation insurance. Whether you're a buyer or a broker, we're going to help you navigate the world of private aviation insurance. Today I have my guest, Matt White, who is the CEO, business owner of BWI Aviation Insurance Agency. They've got over 9,000 aircraft insured, so they know exactly what they're talking about. If you can't get it written, go to Matt and his team and you'll have the best shot of getting a risk written with this team. They also are the pioneers of the iFly quote software that is going to be used across the insurance agency hopefully in the near future, because it's one of the fastest ways to get quotes for insurance brokers with all the carriers. So we're super excited to bring Matt. He's a family man. We were just talking about back to school stuff and we're just really pumped to have him on here. So, Matt, welcome.

Speaker 1: 1:43

Thank you, Tom, for that intro. I appreciate that. Really great to finally be on your podcast. I know we've been trying to get together for a couple of months now and I'm super excited to chat with you about the world of aviation insurance everybody's most interesting, favorite topic.

Speaker 2: 1:58

Let's go pump it up. Well, you know it's funny. My father-in-law is in the insurance business and you know it's one of those things where you think you don't need it, but if you don't have it you're going to want it in certain situations. Better to have it and not need it than to not have it and want it and need it. So I'm just kind of curious what got you into the insurance world to begin with, because it's not something that you know. Kind of curious what? What got you into the insurance world to begin with? Cause it's not something that you know. A lot of kids go to school. When you ask them what do you want to be to grow up? Uh, insurance comes across. And then, of course, you, in my opinion, you know you hit the jackpot. Where you're, at least in aviation. Insurance was kind of like the the cool kids club. You're the maverick of the insurance world. So tell us a little bit how you got into it.

Speaker 1: 2:44

Yeah, absolutely so. I don't. I agree with you. I don't think. You know.

Speaker 1: 2:48

Almost nobody says when I grew up, I want to be in the world, I want to be an aviation insurance broker. My dad owned an aviation insurance company very small company when I was a kid. I used to go there after school and help with filing, and even that he owned a brokerage. I never thought I would end up working for him or working in the industry, and I think it's true for most people. I mean most of the people that work for us or that are friends with us. They never wake up and say I'm going to be an aircraft insurance broker when I grow up. They kind of fall into it and it's a really crazy, interesting, exciting, well-paying career to fall into. And so my story personally, you know, I went to school. I went was getting into trouble when I graduated high school, so joined the Marines. They straightened me out for sure and started some businesses after that and realized I really liked business and growing businesses, and then I had the opportunity to get involved with, and eventually buy my dad's aircraft insurance agency and so I started working there in 2011 and started revamping all the technology. And started revamping all the technology. You know, we had paper files and all that stuff back then and then I got the opportunity to buy it in 2016. So I bought the company and, you know, fell in love with the industry.

Speaker 1: 4:15

Insuring airplanes. Everybody's like what is that? What is insuring airplanes? And I think, like you said, it's a cool kids club. It's definitely very exciting. Every single day is something different. It's a different plane, it's a different pilot, it's a different aircraft to use, different situation every single day. Every day is interesting, every risk is interesting and you know, I absolutely love it. And the industry it's a very small industry, very small, close-knit industry and the demand for young people, young talented professionals going into this industry very high demand. We need lots of people. We need lots of really good people.

Speaker 2: 4:59

Well, I'm going to veer off track for a quick second. How does one become an aviation insurance program? Veer off track for a quick second. How does one become an aviation insurance program? I mean, do you have to go for a property and casualty and kind of go that route and then just kind of know somebody, or can you hop right into it? Is there? Is there an aviation license, certification for aviation insurance? Like how does that work?

Speaker 1: 5:17

yeah, absolutely it's. It's uh, it's harder than you would think to get in to. It feels that yeah, yeah to yeah to get in. So the people that we tend to hire and recruit either are one of two things they are an insurance broker, but they're not into aviation. They're an auto insurance broker. They're home and they're bored. They want to join the Cool Kids Club, they want to do something different. So they come to us and we can teach them and the industry has tools we can teach them aviation. They combine that with insurance and they're an aviation insurance broker.

Speaker 1: 5:53

The other side of it is pilots pro pilots especially, um that are tired of traveling. They're looking, you know, they're starting a family, they're looking for more consistency. They love aviation, but a lot of times aviation doesn't pay very well, and so those we've had a lot of those people come to us and we can train insurance. We've got the aviation, we train insurance. You put those two things together and that's how you that's the right approach to get into the industry. There's a lot of I say a lot there's a few industry courses. The AIA, the Aviation Insurance Association, has their own certification and intro courses and things like that, but there's a lack of certifications and courses within the industry in general, so do the pilots need anything, Because I mean, obviously, if they're insurance people, they have their, their, their license.

Speaker 1: 6:47

Yeah, if they're a pilot, they got to get their insurance license, their property and casualty insurance.

Speaker 2: 6:50

I do.

Speaker 1: 6:51

Okay.

Speaker 2: 6:52

Interesting. Well, I actually did insurance for a little while. Like I said, my father-in-law is an insurance broker, his own agency. I sold property in casualty, I got my health and life insurance and I only lasted about maybe a year or so because I just Underwriters man, I could get them in, I could do the sales, I could close the deal, but then all of a sudden the underwriter is like yeah, no, and so it was just, it was rough, but let's get into talking about insurance for first-time jet owners. Oh, I meant to ask actually, before I do that, are you a pilot and an aircraft owner yourself? I'm not gotcha, okay, I love, I love that. That's exactly how I was when I first started out, like people would ask me, are you a pilot?

Speaker 2: 7:36

like nope, but I can sell jets like nope, but I can get you the right coverage 100. Cool. So let's talk about first-time Um. What do they need to be aware of? Um, let's say they. Let's say they don't have an aircraft. We'll talk about if they're moving in from a piston to or a turboprop into the jet world. But let's just say first time jet owners and or just like first time aircraft owners. What do people need to know about aviation insurance? Sure.

Speaker 1: 8:07

So let me kind of focus on um first time aircraft owners. I'm thinking you know single engine, land your one 72, is your your general uh land aviation aircraft. Um, so once you have an aircraft make and model that you know you're looking to purchase um, and whether you're a student pilot or private pilot or etc once you know that aircraft make and model and and, um, typically the you know right around the ballpark of the whole value, the value of the aircraft.

Speaker 1: 8:39

That's the point that you want to engage a broker and start shopping for aircraft insurance and before that you can call us. We can give you super brief ballpark insurance cost. You know this is what it's going to cost to insure that airplane, but really we want to know what's the aircraft make and model, what's the whole value, and then what does it look like for you as a pilot, what are your qualifications, hours, et cetera, and then we can start providing quotes and going across the industry to find the best policy for you. The other thing that I think a lot of people miss is the training requirements insurance, pilot training requirements. If you're buying a new airplane, if you're transitioning into a higher performance airplane, you're going to have insurance training.

Speaker 1: 9:26

You know pilot training requirements, dual sim school, all that kind of stuff, and a lot of times people are focused on the cost of insurance. 46 or a vision jet or you know, a more advanced aircraft like that. The quotes that your broker is going to get back, the insurance quotes that your broker is going to send to you, they're going to have different prices, but they're going to have way different training requirements. So one company might have a lower you know insurance costs but they're requiring 20 hours of dual or something you know, versus you get back a higher premium quote and they're requiring a CFI checkoff, right?

Speaker 1: 10:10

So so the training requirements is what I think most people miss. And, um, you know, and? And the other part of it is hey, you know, I want to go buy a new airplane. I buy the airplane and then, oh, now I need to get insurance. I forgot the insurance piece, now I need to get insurance. Call a broker and A you know, and sometimes there's situations we can't offer insurance based on pilot training and maybe the complexity of the aircraft or maybe there's claims history or things like that, and now it's a problem, especially if you have a bank on the loan trying to buy this airplane. You can't get insurance, big problem. Or the second thing is the training requirements. I bought an airplane, now I get insurance and now I have to do 20, 10 hours, 20 hours, and I don't want to do that, I just want to go fly the airplane. So I think those are the two most common things people miss.

Speaker 2: 11:00

So with the training, then if I buy an aircraft and they require 10 hours of training, is my aircraft covered while I'm training, or is it? We won't? We'll give you a spot in line but we will not buy in the coverage and it won't be active until you complete the training.

Speaker 1: 11:19

Yeah, absolutely so. If there's pilot training requirements, you take possession of the aircraft, you start the insurance policy. Of course, if there's a bank, you know the finance alone of the aircraft. You have to have insurance, you have to have whole coverage. So you start the insurance policy as soon as you become the owner of the airplane and if there's training requirements on there. So, first of all, if the aircraft's on the ground and the hangar burns up and burns your airplane, you know if you have whole coverage on the insurance policy, there's going to be coverage for the aircraft. If you have pilot training requirements, usually it will stipulate um, these are the five hours or 10 hours of dual you need to, you know, complete prior to carrying passengers. Um, so you're covered while you're training, while you're completing those five or 10 hours dual, something happens to your plane, you know there's, there's coverage there, as long as you don't carry passengers before you've completed that training coverage there as long as you don't carry passengers before you've completed that training.

Speaker 2: 12:19

That makes sense. That makes sense. So you kind of alluded to this. Maybe it's similar to cars, so you can ensure the whole value of the aircraft. And then there's also other coverages that include. So can you walk us through some of the coverages, or basic coverages, that people need to think about? And brokers, you know. Frankly, you know part of this conversation is hey, if you're a broker, you want to be knowledgeable about this stuff so you can advise your clients. Hey, we need to talk to an insurance broker because of A, b and C. So what are some of the coverages that people typically look at when they're looking at aviation insurance?

Speaker 1: 12:52

Absolutely, so the base coverage is liability coverage insurance, absolutely so. The base coverage is liability coverage. And as soon as you become an aircraft owner, your legal liability risk increases because you're the owner of an aircraft that can damage, hurt somebody. Your liability exposure increases and so that's the base coverage on every aircraft insurance policy is liability coverage. It's also the most inexpensive part of the policy. I mean, you're looking at a couple hundred bucks for a 172 for the whole year of liability coverage. And liability coverage protects you, the aircraft owner, from any property or personal damage that your aircraft causes. So if you're taxing, you hit somebody, hit a car. You know all that kind of stuff. If you have passengers in the aircraft, there's a sublimit for passengers in the aircraft and that's the base coverage is liability coverage.

Speaker 1: 13:54

Definitely, if you own an airplane, you really need liability coverage. You can't control a lot of things. You can't control weather, you can't control what happens at the airport and if something does happen, you want that. Usually a million dollars in liability coverage ready to go to protect you Because, as you know, today everybody's too happy, especially with people that own an airplane. Something happens, everybody's going to sue everybody. You want that liability coverage. So that's the base coverage. Ninety five percent of our customers have one million dollars in liability coverage and that's limited to one hundred thousand per passenger. And, briefly, how that works is let's say you own a 172, you have two passengers in the aircraft. Something happens. Both passengers are, you know, significantly injured. You have up to 100,000 for each of those passengers for any legal liabilities that you know that they come after you for, okay.

Speaker 1: 14:53

So let's say 200,000, 100,000 each passenger. Out of your million dollars, you now have $800,000 left for any damage. We call it outside of the aircraft. So if you, you know, god forbid hit a house or another hangar, car or something that's how that's how it works. There's usually no passenger or there's no coverage for crew. So you, as the aircraft owner and the pilot, you're a crew. There's no insurance coverage for you. That's pilot life insurance. That's a. That's a different thing from the policies that we offer.

Speaker 2: 15:25

So, so if, if I didn't know any better as an owner or as a broker, and the owner just gets liability coverage, I would have thought that the pilot and the co-pilot were covered and you're telling me, no, there needs to be another product, maybe a rider or something that would go on in addition to that policy. Correct, interesting, okay, okay, gotcha, okay, so we're looking at. I'm kind of curious and okay, so we're looking at. I'm kind of curious. Do you have any examples or any stories about where the aviation insurance saved the day or would have saved the day if it were there, in your experience with these pilots and with these owners For legal liability yeah, legal liability, or just kind of? In general, I'm kind of curious, just some of the stories that you've seen over the years of why aviation insurance is important, you know, because I think that's that always kind of brings it to light. Like, for example, like I remember I heard a story of a. It was an owner with his CFI and you know they were at the airport and you know the CFI, they were 2A guys and you know the CFI was showing him his concealed carry for the day and you know, as he goes to clears it. He figures everything is good to go and part of his clearing process was to actually pull the trigger to make sure that there's nothing in there. And so in doing so, believe it or not, there was something in there. And so all of a sudden, there there's a, there's a puncture in the, in the, in the bottom half of of the little uh of the aircraft, and, um, I mean, they I don't think they ended up reporting, I think they just kind of patched it up and it was fine, it was no big deal.

Speaker 2: 17:20

But you know things like that you just never know what's going to happen around planes is kind of my point.

Speaker 2: 17:25

And so you want to have the coverage so that if something much worse like what if you know the discharge had gone and hurt somebody, or what if it didn't hit in a safe spot and it hit in the fuel tank and that was a problem, and now that you got a fuel leak, all that kind of stuff it's the importance of not just I don't even know if aviation insurance would have necessarily covered that. You know, because you need to work with a professional to know, like we said, the pilots is an additional rider Maybe. Maybe certain situations are additional coverages that people think that they just check the box of yep, I've got insurance and now I'm good to go. But they forget. These companies write the policies in such a way that, unless you're very specific, they're they're not going to just like wave a magic wand and cover you for anything. I mean, they write the policies in a way that you know will cover you, but there's some qualifiers there.

Speaker 1: 18:19

Yeah, yeah, that's a great question. Thanks for bringing that up. I think there's a there's a lack of information, knowledge about aircraft insurance the whole in the whole United States, and I'd love to clear some of that up. So a couple of things. We talked about the first coverage, liability coverage. Definitely you're an aircraft owner, protect your liability exposure with that basic policy. The second coverage on a policy is physical damage coverage for the aircraft itself, damage coverage for the aircraft itself. So if you're, if your Cessna 150 is worth 50,000, you should have, in my opinion, $50,000 in physical damage coverage on the aircraft.

Speaker 1: 19:02

This is different than car insurance. Car insurance, auto insurance is based off of appreciation and and and value depreciation. Aircraft insurance is based on agreed value. So there's no, there's no depreciation. It's the one made one of the biggest differences between auto insurance and aircraft insurance. So you buy one 50, you know it's. You think it's worth 50,000.

Speaker 1: 19:21

You come to me hey, matt, I'd like a quote for 50,000 whole coverage. I shopped the market. I get you a quote Once, the insurance once. I send your information out to the insurance company and they send back a quote that says $50,000, here's a quote for $50,000 whole coverage. They're agreeing with me and you that the $150,000 is worth $50,000. So they give us a quote, we buy the policy. If your CESTA 150 burns down in the hangar or if you crash land and it's a complete loss, they're going to take a check of $50,000 and send you exactly what the value was less any deductibles. So there's no. What is it worth now? What are the avionics worth? It's agreed value, insured for that, and that's what you get if there, if there's a total loss, that's what you get if there's a total loss. So those are the primary two coverages and the accents and the claims and how insurance plays into it. It's wild, it's actually it's really.

Speaker 1: 20:22

So there's, you know and this is what I'd love to get this out to so many people the insurance company that you're with. There's about 24 insurance companies that insure airplanes.

Speaker 2: 20:31

Yeah, not a lot Compared to cars.

Speaker 1: 20:34

any idea how many car insurance companies there are Hundreds, and hundreds of car insurance companies, only 23 or 24 of them will insure airplanes and each of those companies is different. So when you buy an insurance policy, you need to know you know the history on the insurance company. The first, the most important thing, is the history on the insurance company. What does the policy look like? How's the policy worded? How strong is that policy in your favor if you have an accident? And then the third one is everybody you know doesn't understand this or messes this up. A lot is building a multi-year relationship with that insurance company. People that I think shop around every year to save $100, $150 and they move to a different insurance company. They're messing, they're ruining that opportunity to build a multi-year relationship with that company. And I had an accident in Alaska a couple of years ago. One of our customers and he had a 185 and he decided to put skis on the aircraft and didn't let us know that he put skis on the aircraft. He didn't let the insurance company know that he had skis and this was a $275,000, uh, cessna 185 and landing and landing on skis and one of the ski gear breaks on landing was not, was not pilot error, that was equipment malfunction, ski breaks, prop strike aircraft tumbles, complete aircraft 275,000. Calls me. We look at the policy and he says yeah, I was landing on skis and I said we're covered for wheels.

Speaker 1: 22:13

On this pause there's, we didn't add skis coverage. And he goes I didn't know, I needed to add, you know, skis coverage, you know on a completely honest mistake. So we turn the claim into the insurance company. And this is where the insurance company matters and your relationship, your long-term relationship with that company matters. Turn the claim into the insurance company. Insurance company says we're going to deny the claim. We, you know, we, we, this aircraft's not covered for skis. So I call the underwriter and I say I know you guys, you know, aren't obligated to cover this. However, this customer has been with you for seven years. Great paying customer, built that relationship, never had a claim until today. Is there anything we can do? Underwriter looks at the policy yeah, he's been with us seven years. You know what? We're going to make an exception. We're going to cover this. It was an honest mistake. He forgot to add a skis coverage.

Speaker 1: 23:03

That's the difference between zero coverage and $275,000 in aircraft coverage. So you know I like that example that illustrates, you know, the power of having a relationship and being with a very good aviation insurance company.

Speaker 2: 23:20

Well, that's a great insurance carrier, but it's also a great broker to advocate on your behalf. Because, at the end of the day, you as an owner like you're the aircraft owner like you don't get to talk to mr underwriter and plead your case, right, okay, only the brokers do that. And and so having a good relationship with your broker that makes them want to go to bat for you, like that's really important, and the more of a relationship you have, the more that they can go to bat for you. I mean that's also a testament to, I think, how well like you guys conduct your business as brokers on behalf of your clients.

Speaker 1: 23:56

Yeah, and I think that's why, um, you know, if you want an airplane, you want to be insured with a broker that specializes only in aviation. There's a lot of you know, they do auto and they do home and they also do aviation. Well, if you, you know, you call me. Hey, I need an insurance policy. I might want $275,000, 185, as they're getting that initial information from you what's your pilot information with your qualifications, what you know, what type of aircraft?

Speaker 1: 24:20

Whatever, if they forget to ask you hey, um, is this aircraft ever on skis? These little tiny you would never think to ask is that aircraft on skis? And if that's a yes or no, if that's a yes, out of the 22 aviation insurance companies, maybe only six will cover if the aircraft's on skis, and in those six companies they're all different. So some of those companies will automatically cover skis. Some of those companies will only cover skis if you change and endorse the policy to add skis coverage. So it's not like just taking the data and the aircraft, sending it out and getting a quote. There's so much special knowledge you need to know with individual airplanes, individual insurance companies and how that all plays out to recommend the best insurance policy.

Speaker 2: 25:11

That's a lot. Um, this might be a little tangential, but is there some kind of a software or a system that you got, a tool that you guys can use to make it easier for yourselves, um, as brokers, to find the right coverage and ask the right questions for your clients?

Speaker 1: 25:28

So, yeah, we have. So we have two, two pieces of software. It's it really comes down to, I think, learning in the industry and having years of experience. And that's why you know your question how do you get into the industry? Well, that, I think that's step one getting into the industry. But step two is like, as you, as you work with different types of aircraft and different insurance companies and different pilots for two, three, four, five years, 10 years, you start.

Speaker 1: 25:54

You just start learning all these, all these little nuances. Some of them are you make mistakes, others can be taught. You go through the courses and all that. But that's the real value of having somebody with experience in the industry. And actually that's kind of how our pay scale is set up for our employees. Like year one, when we have a new hire, that's learning from us. You're learning all these nuances and different things about insurance. Our base salaries are pretty low, but year two, three, four and five, they ramp up dramatically because you're learning so much knowledge about the industry and you're so much more valuable, not only to us but to our customers when they call and talk to you.

Speaker 2: 26:40

Yeah, well, I got to say your insurance brokers I've had the pleasure to work with them directly are I've had the pleasure to work with them directly and if I had to imagine, based on what you just said, jackie's a millionaire she must have skyrocketed way up there. We'll make sure she hears this part of the video. It's the value for sure. So, first of all, matt, I appreciate all of nuances and the info that you shed light on for buyers, for guys who want to own an aircraft and need to be thinking about things, about insurance. I think you broke it down really, really well the fact that you're going to have liability. You're also going to have property coverage.

Speaker 2: 27:23

You also talked about the fact of how important there's only 24 carriers and so don't just go shopping around, even brokers. It's not healthy to go shopping around because, at the end of the day, there's only 24. Once you quote somebody, another broker is not really going to get much of a better quote for you, unless they maybe ask different questions. But that's the great thing about starting with you guys that know what you're doing is that you know that you're asking the right questions to get the best price. So if they quote, if you get a quote, you know, and maybe they don't like they go somewhere else and like, oh look, this policy is, like you know, a thousand dollars cheaper. It's like, well, look at the questions. You know, did they? Um, you know, did they ask the right questions? Do you have any advice for people that it would just be common, kind of common for them to shop around with, uh, different, different brokers?

Speaker 1: 28:06

I do and I made a quick YouTube video about how to shop for aircraft insurance the right way. And it's really not the aircraft owner's fault because we're inundated with car insurance commercials, with GEICO and auto insurance shop everywhere. Give us a call, we'll go everywhere and people take that train of thought when they're shopping for aircraft insurance. And you almost couldn't mess it up any more than that. As soon as like if you call one broker, they're going to shop. You know all 24 insurance companies. If you get another broker involved, it's going to mess up the entire process.

Speaker 1: 28:43

It happens all the time and it's a communication disconnect between you know aircraft owners looking to get a simple insurance policy and how the industry operates. The industry super small industry. There's not enough underwriters to go around. The underwriters are overwhelmed if they're working on a quote for BWI and another broker gets the same tail number and shops it to them and another broker gets the same tail number by the second or third broker, they're just like. I'm not even going to quote this, I don't have enough time. I'm seeing they're shopping around everywhere I'm out. I'm not going to quote this, let's move on to somebody else.

Speaker 1: 29:19

So I think that's one of the biggest misconceptions is shop around. If you hire a broker like myself or one of our competitors, it's their job to shop around for you. It's not like you call another broker. You're not shopping around any other new companies. The only company that's different than from what we do is a Vemco. A Vemco is its own you know insurance company and they have very specific makes and models that they like to insure. Any other you know aircraft insurance broker is going to shop you with the same 22, 24 insurance companies.

Speaker 2: 29:54

Gotcha, that's a great piece of advice. I appreciate that. Well, let's pivot for a second because, like I said, I do have firsthand working with you guys and the reason I was working with not so much for aircraft ownership was as a broker. You know's, there's professional liability that comes with being an aircraft broker. Like you said, people like to sue for all kinds of reasons and, you know, even despite our best efforts, there may be opportunities where, or there may be times where, we find ourselves, um, you know, our, our actions or our decisions called into question, and you, yeah, insurance coverage is important. So can you talk to us a little about professional liability, errors and omissions? I'm just going to throw a bunch of buzzwords so people think I know what I'm talking about and maybe you can explain it to us and why it would be important for brokers to have some an aviation professional services liability insurance policy.

Speaker 1: 30:53

So it's a liability policy specific to aviation businesses and you can get coverage. Typically, I recommend at least a million dollars in liability coverage on one of these policies. They go all the way up to five or $10 million liability and these's a lot that can go wrong and a lot of stuff that's unintentional on your side. But a paper wasn't checked, a field wasn't checked, something happened and that's what those policies are designed to protect your business for. So I definitely recommend everybody should carry an aviation professional liability insurance policy.

Speaker 2: 31:56

Absolutely so. Is that something where, when I first start out, I should get an insurance policy as a broker? Or is that something that maybe the insurance carriers want to see, proof that you've been doing this a little while and they won't even cover you when you first start out, because obviously, when you're first starting out, you could be a really big risk for the carrier? So how, how do carriers kind of see it, and when's the right time? When do you know is the right time to get the coverage?

Speaker 1: 32:23

Yeah, so. So I personally recommend I wouldn't sell an airplane until I had some type of professional aviation professional liability insurance policy myself. You brought up a great point that the two data points that companies look at when they're quoting these type of policies is A how much experience do you have, does your company have, in selling airplanes? And then the second part is what kind of revenue, what kind of you know? How many are you doing a month? How much are you doing a year? And I guess the third thing is what is your sales process? Have you thought about reducing risk? Have you thought about how to mitigate all these errors and emissions? And that's why you know. You go back to point one, like how long you've been doing this? Well, as you've been doing this for years and years and years. You start, you make mistakes, just like we do on aviation insurance. You make mistakes and you learn and you get that industry knowledge and that is valuable to the insurance companies and you'll get a lower rate the more insurance you have or the more experience you have.

Speaker 2: 33:29

That makes sense. Okay, that makes a lot of sense. Well, listen, matt. This has been a great conversation. I really do appreciate your time, energy and effort to be here. If people want to get more information, whether it's aircraft owners that are looking for a quote or brokers that are looking for a quote on professional liability where can people contact you at?

Speaker 1: 33:52

Absolutely. Visit our website, bwiflyflycom, or you can email me directly, matt. At BWIFlycom, our website, you can get a quote. There's tons of blogs, articles and, of course, email me directly and be happy to help you out and be happy to help you out.

Speaker 2: 34:10

Very cool. And also, I would encourage you guys to check out Matt on YouTube BWI Fly Live Great resource there, similar to the information that he's posted, but a lot more as well. So, once again, matt, thanks so much for being here and we'll catch you later.

Speaker 1: 34:27

Awesome, tom. Thanks again, take care.